Issue with the game´s LAN creation

[plebeian]

Hello again,

    Terribly sorry for troubling with my gaming issues, but I could not find any solution to a new problem my friend and I have been having. I do not remember the details how it happened, but I have renewed our LoM:SE games some time ago, either with a newer version of your mod, or a clean install from the ground up (old game + newest mod), and now there is an issue creating a multiplayer LAN game. To be precise, whenever either of us try to push the Create button after naming a game, it clicks, but does not proceed to the Leader selection. The issue is not present in Direct Cable selection, the game allowed us to select a leader.

    I know there is something that I am missing that is not related to the version of the game, or the mod installed, but I cannot pinpoint with my limited knowledge. So, I was wondering, would anyone be kind enough to help me find out the deeper inner-workings behind a LAN game´s creation? That way I could know where to look for the root cause.

    Tried solutions that did not work:

    1. Game´s compatibility change to Windows 95, also giving it Administrator´s privileges,

    2. Launching from the base game, both on the disc and downloaded (same issue),

    3. Setting exceptions in the Firewall, both as an Inbound Rule and Exception,

    4. Adding to the exception list of Data Execution Prevention,

    5. Running with Gameranger (worked like a charm for the host, but the other player could not join or see game, was stuck in the main screen),

    6. Uninstalling Gameranger (in case it took over the connection management of the game, silly idea, but still),

    7. Launching with a previous version of the GS5R3 mod (do not recall which, current one is 3.02.3204, but same effect).

[Boaster]

64-bit Windows?

[plebeian]

Yes, 64-bit, Windows 7.

[Boaster]

IPX/SPX protcol is 16-bit, and there is no 64-bit wrapper to use this. Windows 32-bit has a 32-bit wrapper to use the protocol.


You will need to download the IPX Wrapper.

www.solemnwarning.net/ipxwrapper/

[plebeian]

Oh, I forgot to mention that part, but we both have, and used the IPX wrapper, combined with the 64-bit.reg registry editing file. Just in case, I will do a clean install anew and report back.

[Boaster]

Well, the last time I've tried playing Game Ranger there were problems. It is not likely they gave any attention to LOMSE to fix whatever issue that was created with it.

Try KALI. KALI is free, but the interface is a bit more complicated.

[plebeian]

    Turns out that the IPXwrapper was the root cause, yes. Not the program itself, but the user... While trying out Gameranger, it did not agree with the wsock32.dll of the wrapper while launching, so I had it removed during testing, but forgot to put it back. Just tested it now for both computers, LAN launched and connected without issues using the latest version of your Mod.

    Though, while the original issue was resolved, I do have a silly wonder that might be relevant to prevent future questions... Do the IPX wrapper configurations have impact on the stability of the game? No disrespect meant, I understand and remember your forewarning about guaranteed de-syncs during a session, but they seemed rather random during our testing. Sometimes we would use Default wrapper setting, sometimes a Hamachi Interface, sometimes a different port, and the results would vary. Sometimes the game would run smoothly, with a few de-syncs during 2-3 hours of gameplay, sometimes 2-3 de-syncs would happen in the span of minutes...

    My question would be: is there a logic behind the AI/player caused de-syncs, or do they happen due to too many causes to list? I know, I´ve asked about them before, but it makes me wonder if different settings could lead to different outcomes. The map we used was the same, a modified version of Giganta256.scn with more ¨dungeons¨ added. I assume a smaller map would lead to a more stable experience, but it was interesting to push the multiplayer of this game to it´s limits.

[Boaster]

I have no answer for as to WHY the multiplayer games with AI cause sync issues.

Sync issues generally arise when each human player witnesses two different accounts for the same event. In order to bring the game back in sync, the game has to be reloaded with a save to get things matching again.

[plebeian]

Fair enough, you have done a lot of Golgoth´s work already. *shot*

    It´s still a fascinating topic, shame that I cannot dissect the multiplayer interactions myself... However, as a note, sometimes a reload of a save file is not enough. We have had "stuck" desyncs happen consistently, like clicking a Leader in a building or during a certain moment at an AI´s turn. Since it was late in the game (86+ turns), I suspect it could have been related to the amount of units in total, controlled by the AI, players, as well marauding parties. The only ¨guaranteed¨ case we have encountered, was the creation of a Lich, which would cause an immediate desync, forcing a load, but that´s likely no news.

    But that´s just my unrelated musings... Thank you for all your help, really. We wouldn´t have been able to enjoy the game as we do now, if it weren´t for your time and effort!

[Boaster]

There any number of things that can effect desyncs outside of AI players.

Toggling map or combat speed can contribute deync occuring over time.

Attempting trades with AI can contribute.

Summoning the Lich I think can contribute. Or using special buildings.


Overland map sync issues aren't as bad as the ones in combat. In combat, the sync issues occur mostly with regards to projectile weapons and moving around corner spaces of non-passable terrain.

[plebeian]

That´s interesting to know, thank you very much for informing us!

I did not know about the map or combat speed tweaking, so it's good to keep aware of.

    The AI trading, can confirm. Whenever an AI would trade willingly with a player, it had a good chance to get out of sync. It seemed less prominent  when the player was the one trading, since I have managed to Plea spells of my faith to 7 other Lords in a turn, or rapid-trade a faith to mutual Devotion, and it never desynced. Maybe it affects the game in the long run, but seems to be the case mostly during the AI's turn.

    Summoning the Lich is a definite desync, at least for us on the current version. Strangely enough, summoning the Sacred Knight did not cause a similar effect, or using any of the other Special Buildings (uncertain, since we did not use them much in total). I suspect that the sacrificing of a Death Mage in order to create a Lich acts as a major imbalance in terms of synchronizing progress, or maybe the Lich is simply too powerful for the network to comprehend... who knows?

     Speaking of the Lich, not certain if it was mentioned before, but if a Mercenary Death Mage would be sacrificed in order to cut costs, the Lich will actually retain it´s Mercenary status, and demand it´s upkeep of Crystals based on it´s level, up to 75/turn. Just found it interesting, is all.

    Regarding combat, we still remember your guidelines. You did a great job fixing many of the game´s combat inducers as is, especially the Page up/Page down toggling. However, it´s still curious as to what exactly in the projectiles causes the issues... You´ve mentioned, a desync is essentially two computers seeing different outcomes from a projectile, where one sees it deal 3 damage, and the other sees it as 2, 1 or a block. However, it makes me wonder if magic projectiles contribute as much: like casting flashy spells like Judgement, Locusts, Gift of Life, or spamming basic bolt spells using your F1 shortcut.

    I will keep in mind the non-passable terrain, though. Sounds like another point to avoid, makes sense why.

[Boaster]

With the arrow keys and adjusting the orientation that causes an "update" effect to the view, the spell projectiles will skip tiles.

As far as physical attack projectiles, two computers can see different things because perhaps on one screen a unit could be facing a different direction which would lend itself to a different calculation of the projectile hitting, and for how much damage.

These are all very tiny little variations that, in combat, can seemingly create big differences.

In combat, I tried to disable any hotkey that would force a player to "center on" either a unit or toggle to a location, which appears to follow the same instructions in the code.

[plebeian]

    True, it´s fairly easy to see how that would cause desynchronizations, and all of your tweaks to combat, both small and large, helped shape it to the way it is. I was genuinely surprised how it is possible to keep multiplayer consistent even when casting multitudes of spells after combat (most noteworthy example being Raise Skeleton -> Visage of Horror -> Embrace of Golgoth). Large battles are still an issue, but that could be negated to an extent by the other player looking at an empty corner.

    However, I did notice a possibly related case to the view updates on the adventure map as well, though. If the speed is increased (which shouldn't be, but still), and a player moves along a direction of the map with the mouse, while ordering the unit to move at the same time, the unit actually moves much faster than while visible, if that makes sense. It's probably nothing, but would likely also be a cause for a reload.

    Also, feel free to ignore this unrelated note, but I was wondering... It is likely greedy or silly of me to ask, but is there any way to select a single champion in a group using hotkeys? The usage of B for Berserk, D for Defend, T for Stealth and F1 and F2 keys for offensive and defensive magics is a veeery welcome addition, and encourages gameplay without the Pause button, but so far, I've only managed to find hotkeys to select entire groups, meaning, Champion + units. Is/Would it be possible to select individual champions to use their tactical edge in battle, or would/is that asking too much? 

[Boaster]

CTRL plus a number will allow you to set that unit to it's own control group number.

[plebeian]

Thaaat's the stuff! Thank you for all the clear and concise information you've provided, even beyond the scope of the presented issue. We have no more questions, for now, just gratitude.