Keeps and Artifacts

[l'Ancien]

On some other points. I've noticed that the "Keep" has been renamed for the local team, but that it no longer has the greater artifact. Instead, the greater artifacts seem to be hidden in Amazon Keeps scattered around the map. I like the idea of a longer quest to find the artifact, but could you mix the ideas, and put the greater artifact in the appropriate keep, and put the appropriate keep in the territory of another faith? Either that, or rename the keeps with the artifacts as Mysterious Keeps again, but just put the artifacts in the wrong areas, so you never know which artifact will be in a given mysterious keep (mysterious, see).

[Boaster]

When the game looks to place artifacts, such as the Legendary weapons, it looks to the HIGHEST level dungeon in the area. The highest level dungeon does not include Great Temples.

The lowest 8 or 9 encounters in any one region will not produce any artifact or scroll spoils.

If the highest level dungeon in the region is level 6, that dungeon will be the designated dungeon to reward a player with a Legendary Artifact. In my mod, Greater Artifacts = Legendary Artifacts.


Now... artifacts for Order champions such as Ring of Protection, Amulet of Defense, or Sword of Quality, or even Armor of Inspiration will not necessarily be found in the Order Region. Is this what you are requesting?

[l'Ancien]

admin said:

When the game looks to place artifacts, such as the Legendary weapons, it looks to the HIGHEST level dungeon in the area. The highest level dungeon does not include Great Temples.

The lowest 8 or 9 encounters in any one region will not produce any artifact or scroll spoils.

If the highest level dungeon in the region is level 6, that dungeon will be the designated dungeon to reward a player with a Legendary Artifact. In my mod, Greater Artifacts = Legendary Artifacts.


Now... artifacts for Order champions such as Ring of Protection, Amulet of Defense, or Sword of Quality, or even Armor of Inspiration will not necessarily be found in the Order Region. Is this what you are requesting?

I thought it was what I was observing, but I didn't test it exhaustively.

I placed some level 11 encounters on the border between Death and Fire, in my map. When I attacked the Fiery keep, I found a water scroll (Guardian Waves or something). Then I wondered if my artifact got misplaced, so I went down and cleaned out the level 11 encounters on the border with Death territory. I still didn't find it. So I set off to clear out other high level encounters. In the Chaos territory, I attacked an Amazon Keep, and found the blowgun of the Amazons (or something, you'd renamed it). That seemed logical, but I was surprised to find it in the Chaos territory. I went down to the Dwarven Keep in Earth territory, and found another scroll. In the meantime one of my scouts located another Amazon Keep, which I didn't remember encountering in the unmodified game. So I supposed that you had modified the placing of the greater artifacts to not appear in the Fiery keep (or equivalent) and instead to appear in randomly scattered Amazon Keeps.

What I want is to know where to find my Legendary Artifact. I want the Fire Legendary Artifact to appear in the Fiery Keep. I don't care where the Fiery Keep is, but I want it in the Fiery Keep.

If you modified the name, could you modify the level somehow to be higher than placeable encounters (like 13), but have the level interpreted as level 11? (I don't fancy facing a roomful of Fafnirs as a Fire Sorceress, even with Inferno -- one is plenty)

[Boaster]

lancien said:

admin said:

When the game looks to place artifacts, such as the Legendary weapons, it looks to the HIGHEST level dungeon in the area. The highest level dungeon does not include Great Temples.

The lowest 8 or 9 encounters in any one region will not produce any artifact or scroll spoils.

If the highest level dungeon in the region is level 6, that dungeon will be the designated dungeon to reward a player with a Legendary Artifact. In my mod, Greater Artifacts = Legendary Artifacts.


Now... artifacts for Order champions such as Ring of Protection, Amulet of Defense, or Sword of Quality, or even Armor of Inspiration will not necessarily be found in the Order Region. Is this what you are requesting?

I thought it was what I was observing, but I didn't test it exhaustively.

I placed some level 11 encounters on the border between Death and Fire, in my map. When I attacked the Fiery keep, I found a water scroll (Guardian Waves or something). Then I wondered if my artifact got misplaced, so I went down and cleaned out the level 11 encounters on the border with Death territory. I still didn't find it. So I set off to clear out other high level encounters. In the Chaos territory, I attacked an Amazon Keep, and found the blowgun of the Amazons (or something, you'd renamed it). That seemed logical, but I was surprised to find it in the Chaos territory. I went down to the Dwarven Keep in Earth territory, and found another scroll. In the meantime one of my scouts located another Amazon Keep, which I didn't remember encountering in the unmodified game. So I supposed that you had modified the placing of the greater artifacts to not appear in the Fiery keep (or equivalent) and instead to appear in randomly scattered Amazon Keeps.

What I want is to know where to find my Legendary Artifact. I want the Fire Legendary Artifact to appear in the Fiery Keep. I don't care where the Fiery Keep is, but I want it in the Fiery Keep.

If you modified the name, could you modify the level somehow to be higher than placeable encounters (like 13), but have the level interpreted as level 11? (I don't fancy facing a roomful of Fafnirs as a Fire Sorceress, even with Inferno -- one is plenty)

The game looks for the closest and highest level encounter to your capital to designate it with the Legendary artifact. If your have randomized dungeon placement, then the name and sprite of the Dungeon or Keep will be determined by the underlying terrain. So if you're Order, surrounded by Dessert, your dugeon will probably show up as a Firey Keep.

If you want to fight 9 Fafnirs, then use my mod and place down a Level 12 Dragon Lair.

Typically, I have only used level 11 encounters. But I have given other users the option for the upper-most difficulty with level 12 encounters.

So the question is, are you using randomized dungeons or are you placing all of the dungeons yourself?

[l'Ancien]

admin said:

lancien said:

I thought it was what I was observing, but I didn't test it exhaustively.

I placed some level 11 encounters on the border between Death and Fire, in my map. When I attacked the Fiery keep, I found a water scroll (Guardian Waves or something). Then I wondered if my artifact got misplaced, so I went down and cleaned out the level 11 encounters on the border with Death territory. I still didn't find it. So I set off to clear out other high level encounters. In the Chaos territory, I attacked an Amazon Keep, and found the blowgun of the Amazons (or something, you'd renamed it). That seemed logical, but I was surprised to find it in the Chaos territory. I went down to the Dwarven Keep in Earth territory, and found another scroll. In the meantime one of my scouts located another Amazon Keep, which I didn't remember encountering in the unmodified game. So I supposed that you had modified the placing of the greater artifacts to not appear in the Fiery keep (or equivalent) and instead to appear in randomly scattered Amazon Keeps.

What I want is to know where to find my Legendary Artifact. I want the Fire Legendary Artifact to appear in the Fiery Keep. I don't care where the Fiery Keep is, but I want it in the Fiery Keep.

If you modified the name, could you modify the level somehow to be higher than placeable encounters (like 13), but have the level interpreted as level 11? (I don't fancy facing a roomful of Fafnirs as a Fire Sorceress, even with Inferno -- one is plenty)

The game looks for the closest and highest level encounter to your capital to designate it with the Legendary artifact. If your have randomized dungeon placement, then the name and sprite of the Dungeon or Keep will be determined by the underlying terrain. So if you're Order, surrounded by Dessert, your dugeon will probably show up as a Firey Keep.

If you want to fight 9 Fafnirs, then use my mod and place down a Level 12 Dragon Lair.

Typically, I have only used level 11 encounters. But I have given other users the option for the upper-most difficulty with level 12 encounters.

So the question is, are you using randomized dungeons or are you placing all of the dungeons yourself?

I'm using randomized dungeons, and the fiery keep is closer to my capital than the other level 11 encounters.

I don't want extra Fafnirs (one was plenty). What I was looking for was a way to force the randomly placed fiery keep to be the highest level encounter, by setting its level number higher than anything that someone would place. Since you'd already set up level 12 as the highest playable level with multiple legendary creatures, I figured level 13 would be numerically highest for attracting the legendary artifact but if you set level thirteen to have a level 11 encounter setup inside, then it wouldn't be impossible. (With creature resistences, a high-level encounter of your own type can be much more difficult.)

[Boaster]

Level 11 Keeps will have only 1 Legendary Creature in there, followed by two Mages and a Warrior.

I do not think Level 13 will register with the game, nor allow you to enter it.

I would suggest no using Randomized Dungeons if you want the dungeon setup to be a specific way.

All Encounters are available for placement in the Map Editor, and even the Sprites such as Breweries, Gold Mines, and Crystal mines.

So really, it would be to your advantage to not use Randomized Dungeons.


By the way, fighting units of your own faith in the Dungeons only make sense for two reasons. One would be increased difficulty, because your magic would be less effective versus your own kind. Two would be that why would Amazons be inhabiting a Firey Keep? So it only makes sense that Fire units would inhabit such an encounter.

If you place a Firey Keep in the Order Region as Level 11, then that will probably be the place to find Order's Legendary artifact. I'm 90% sure this would be the case.

[l'Ancien]

admin said:

Level 11 Keeps will have only 1 Legendary Creature in there, followed by two Mages and a Warrior.

I do not think Level 13 will register with the game, nor allow you to enter it.

I would suggest no using Randomized Dungeons if you want the dungeon setup to be a specific way.

All Encounters are available for placement in the Map Editor, and even the Sprites such as Breweries, Gold Mines, and Crystal mines.

So really, it would be to your advantage to not use Randomized Dungeons.


By the way, fighting units of your own faith in the Dungeons only make sense for two reasons. One would be increased difficulty, because your magic would be less effective versus your own kind. Two would be that why would Amazons be inhabiting a Firey Keep? So it only makes sense that Fire units would inhabit such an encounter.

If you place a Firey Keep in the Order Region as Level 11, then that will probably be the place to find Order's Legendary artifact. I'm 90% sure this would be the case.

I'm sorry. I changed my idea midthread, because I misunderstood what you had done or not done in my original post. Therefore it may be difficult to follow what I'm saying.

Fire creatures currently and always should inhabit Fiery Keeps. That does make it more challenging than the level implies for a Fire player, but it is worth it to find your Fire Legendary Artifact. I want the Fiery keep to move randomly around the fire capital. I want it to contain the legendary artifact. I have placed other level 11 encounters, but none of them seem to contain the greater artifact.

Since you managed to add level 12 (or was that already there?) I figured you might be able to add level 13 as a playable encounter level. However, rather than making it more difficult (11 is about as hard as anything should be, and 12 already allows for something really over-the-top), I think it should be only as hard as level 11. But since the computer placing the artifacts places the best artifact in the highest level encounter, the Legendary Artifact should appear in the level 13 encounter, if there's only one.

Now, if the only way to get level "13" dungeon is as randomly placed Keeps, then there will only ever be one per faith. So the artifact should reliably be found inside. The artifact placement would then be identical to the original game on the original map, where you always found the greater artifact in the Mysterious Keep somewhere near your capital (but the keep itself kept moving from game to game), which contained a level 11 encounter. (Remember, I'm suggesting that level 13 dungeons should contain only level 11 encounters).

Now, the exact form the keep takes may be controlled by the terrain (which explains all the Amazon Keeps adjacent to water), so there might be some variations if terrain of a foreign kind extends into a certain territory, but pretty reasonably when I want to find my artifact, I would be able to go to the nearby keeps (that think they are level 13 but are level 11 inside).

This is all because I was a little frustrated at taking my Fire Army to the Fiery Keep near my castle and getting it wiped out. So I went back with a better army (all dragons and demons), and finally succeeded in getting … a scroll of Gift of Life!? "What's this good for? Why did the stupid Renegade Fire Sorceress even have a scroll of Gift of Life? Where's my Staff of Incineration!?" were the thoughts running through my mind. It got worse when I couldn't find it in any of the neighboring level 11 encounters, until I finally found a Blowgun. So I thought, wouldn't it be nice if it was right where I expected it to be, in a Fiery Keep, or at least some Keep somewhere?

I haven't finished that game, and I haven't found it yet. I'm still looking.

[Boaster]

I can't help you. Sorry. When the computer randomly generates dungeons, they are placed randomly. No encounters above level 11 are generated by the computer.

All I can tell you is that the highest level encounter in a region will provide the Legendary Artifact.

[l'Ancien]

Thanks.

That's helpful to know. I can manage from that. What that tells me is I need to think about my map design, rather than trying to get a fix from you.

I can do that.

And here I thought you were omnipotent.

j/k

[Boaster]

I am but limited in what I can do, as far as modifying the game.

Also, I cannot say for sure that Level 12 Dungeons will be garanteed to have the legendary artifacts in them. But they should.

[l'Ancien]

I tried your suggestion of placing a level 11 dungeon near my capital. Now it has the scroll of Healing Waters in it.

Are you sure you didn't get the artifacts out of order somehow, so that a Scroll of Healing Waters is considered the Legendary Artifact for a Fire Sorceress?

It's a little weird that another Water Scroll should appear in the spot reserved for the Legendary Fire artifact, again.

And this was with a dungeon I placed by hand, not a randomly placed one.

I suspect a bug, somewhere.

[Boaster]

Maybe if you have more than 1 level 11 dungeon in a particular region, it is random.

[l'Ancien]

But I put it right near my capital.

It even said Firey Keep, but it just had a stupid (probably fatal to Fire) water scroll in it. Although it did come in useful for the water priestess I picked up from that tower. (Just keep her away from the fire elementals, she almost cast Gift of Life on it, I stopped her just in time !)

[Boaster]

lancien said:

But I put it right near my capital.

It even said Firey Keep, but it just had a stupid (probably fatal to Fire) water scroll in it. Although it did come in useful for the water priestess I picked up from that tower. (Just keep her away from the fire elementals, she almost cast Gift of Life on it, I stopped her just in time !)

Scrolls, as far as I know, are dished out randomly. Multiple level 11 dungeons may possibly cause the location of Legendary artifacts to be random. It would have to be experimented.

[l'Ancien]

Maybe I'll have to rethink the wisdom of spamming level eleven dungeons on my map.