Post by tyr on Mar 21, 2009 18:34:00 GMT -6
Modded LOMSE aside (we'll go more into that later ;D) what do you think are the merits the archers that each race have? The developers did try to balance the game (although they fell short of their goal... at least they tried) so in what ways do you think did the developers succeed?
I'll go first with my views.
Earth: Axe Throwers
-Their range is bad and damage is mediocre, but their attack rate is good and they have very good HP and great melee stats. They also level very fast.
All of this implies that they can stay alive in battle (being archers that do good in both range and melee), reaching max level quickly and that they are monsters in early-mid game.
Late game they suffer heavily though as archers from other races pass them by in terms of... well... everything. They have 1 saving grace though: Sands of Sleep. Perhaps the developers throught to gimp them late game since Sands of Sleep basically reduces a battle to a 2 vs 1 fight anyway.
Overland-wise Earth boasts Earthquake (damage has been done before the battle even started) and awesome gold growth - Axe Throwers may be weaker, but they are potentially much more numerous. The developers probably foresaw just how overpowered Earth would be if it had really good archers.
Fire: Rockhurler
-Best melee stats of all the archers, and best individual HP. Mediocre ranged ability, although attack rate is good. The problem is that he only comes in solo.
Fire has arguably the best melee units in the game in my book, tied with Order (Berzerker > Footmen, Order is the strongest in melee in late game but Fire dominates early-mid game). Apparently the designers thought so too, which is why they gimped the Rockhurler somewhat. The Rockhurler, however, has one saving grace: it is the only basic archer unit that can best survive the Inferno spell. Considering that basically no other basic archer unit will remain standing after Infernos/Firestorms, perhaps the developers thought it a good enough tradeoff.
Air: Fae Slingers
-Good ranged capability, very poor melee stats and HP. They fly.
Although good Air players will probably think twice before
using Fae Slingers in serious combat (especially against faiths like Fire or Order... Justice or Inferno, anyone?) the Fae Slingers still have their situational uses, especially in clearing out neutral dwellings. The fact that they can clear out high level dwellings by themselves or launch surprise attack across the seas make them invaluable to anyone... and would justify why the developers awarded them with such ridiculously low HP.
Water: Lizardmen Slingers
-Very tough, but average in every other respect. The fact that they barely have any strengths at all is their main weakness. They synergize very well with Water's spells, however, as at mid-late game you can simply cast Blood Lust on them without worrying too much about their HP once the battle ends.
This is because the Lizardmen Slingers' greatest asset is the fact that as water units they can regain full HP once per day from Water's special building, and from the potions sold therein. Combined with the Healing Waters spell this gives them a good opportunity to capitalize on their inherent toughness - as long as they can survive one battle, they can be ready for the next one fully healed. That's a really scary advantage (especially when Teleport Artifact comes to play) but coming back full circle the Lizardmen are just... well... too average to become overpowered.
Life: Elven Archers
-The best ranged combat units in the game. Great healing rate, low HP weakness.
The Elven Archers are a great piece of work. They balance Life just fine, since the race sorely needed a powerful damaging unit to soften up their enemies before they got too near. The reason for this is simple - Life, unlike Air, had no spells to slow or immobilize their enemies (Headwind, Stun), had little in terms of early-mid damaging spells (Air had Cone of Cold), and Life did not share Air's absolute dominance over overland movement and flight. Life, however, shared the frailty of Air's units... So the developers probably reasoned that their Elven Archers should help balance that.
Order: Crossbowmen
-They're moderately toughm with good ranged damage. Not very effective in melee, but in any case Order's cavalry and the Paladin Lord makes the chances of any enemy successfully getting through them quite grim. Order's spells make them stronger, making them tougher and more damaging. Overall their design was probably meant to simply complement Order's knights - they are not too weak, but also not too strong.
Death: Dark Javelin Throwers
-Very high ranged damage, average HP, poor melee skills, little to non-existent healing rate. Indeed, the developers were particularly brutal in designing the Dark Javelin Throwers, and their only real weakness is their slightly below-average range. Their ranged damage rating is higher than even some Champion thieves', more to balance the fact that once they take damage... they'll stay that way for quite a while.
Chaos: Stickthrowers
-Poor ranged stats, good attack rate, great melee stats, very good HP.
It is actually fitting that the Barbarian archer units were gimped in some way, since the Barbarians were supposed to be frothing berzerkers and not... stickthrowers. They synergize very, very well with Chaos spells, however. This is because Chaos spells generally grant impressive offense bonuses for the price of defense/HP, making Stickthrowers (with their high HP) prime candidates for said buffs. In the event that that these buffs grant no penalty at all and give max bonuses to everything instead, for example, Stickthrowers could very well give even Elven and Dark Elven archers a run for their money.
I'll go first with my views.
Earth: Axe Throwers
-Their range is bad and damage is mediocre, but their attack rate is good and they have very good HP and great melee stats. They also level very fast.
All of this implies that they can stay alive in battle (being archers that do good in both range and melee), reaching max level quickly and that they are monsters in early-mid game.
Late game they suffer heavily though as archers from other races pass them by in terms of... well... everything. They have 1 saving grace though: Sands of Sleep. Perhaps the developers throught to gimp them late game since Sands of Sleep basically reduces a battle to a 2 vs 1 fight anyway.
Overland-wise Earth boasts Earthquake (damage has been done before the battle even started) and awesome gold growth - Axe Throwers may be weaker, but they are potentially much more numerous. The developers probably foresaw just how overpowered Earth would be if it had really good archers.
Fire: Rockhurler
-Best melee stats of all the archers, and best individual HP. Mediocre ranged ability, although attack rate is good. The problem is that he only comes in solo.
Fire has arguably the best melee units in the game in my book, tied with Order (Berzerker > Footmen, Order is the strongest in melee in late game but Fire dominates early-mid game). Apparently the designers thought so too, which is why they gimped the Rockhurler somewhat. The Rockhurler, however, has one saving grace: it is the only basic archer unit that can best survive the Inferno spell. Considering that basically no other basic archer unit will remain standing after Infernos/Firestorms, perhaps the developers thought it a good enough tradeoff.
Air: Fae Slingers
-Good ranged capability, very poor melee stats and HP. They fly.
Although good Air players will probably think twice before
using Fae Slingers in serious combat (especially against faiths like Fire or Order... Justice or Inferno, anyone?) the Fae Slingers still have their situational uses, especially in clearing out neutral dwellings. The fact that they can clear out high level dwellings by themselves or launch surprise attack across the seas make them invaluable to anyone... and would justify why the developers awarded them with such ridiculously low HP.
Water: Lizardmen Slingers
-Very tough, but average in every other respect. The fact that they barely have any strengths at all is their main weakness. They synergize very well with Water's spells, however, as at mid-late game you can simply cast Blood Lust on them without worrying too much about their HP once the battle ends.
This is because the Lizardmen Slingers' greatest asset is the fact that as water units they can regain full HP once per day from Water's special building, and from the potions sold therein. Combined with the Healing Waters spell this gives them a good opportunity to capitalize on their inherent toughness - as long as they can survive one battle, they can be ready for the next one fully healed. That's a really scary advantage (especially when Teleport Artifact comes to play) but coming back full circle the Lizardmen are just... well... too average to become overpowered.
Life: Elven Archers
-The best ranged combat units in the game. Great healing rate, low HP weakness.
The Elven Archers are a great piece of work. They balance Life just fine, since the race sorely needed a powerful damaging unit to soften up their enemies before they got too near. The reason for this is simple - Life, unlike Air, had no spells to slow or immobilize their enemies (Headwind, Stun), had little in terms of early-mid damaging spells (Air had Cone of Cold), and Life did not share Air's absolute dominance over overland movement and flight. Life, however, shared the frailty of Air's units... So the developers probably reasoned that their Elven Archers should help balance that.
Order: Crossbowmen
-They're moderately toughm with good ranged damage. Not very effective in melee, but in any case Order's cavalry and the Paladin Lord makes the chances of any enemy successfully getting through them quite grim. Order's spells make them stronger, making them tougher and more damaging. Overall their design was probably meant to simply complement Order's knights - they are not too weak, but also not too strong.
Death: Dark Javelin Throwers
-Very high ranged damage, average HP, poor melee skills, little to non-existent healing rate. Indeed, the developers were particularly brutal in designing the Dark Javelin Throwers, and their only real weakness is their slightly below-average range. Their ranged damage rating is higher than even some Champion thieves', more to balance the fact that once they take damage... they'll stay that way for quite a while.
Chaos: Stickthrowers
-Poor ranged stats, good attack rate, great melee stats, very good HP.
It is actually fitting that the Barbarian archer units were gimped in some way, since the Barbarians were supposed to be frothing berzerkers and not... stickthrowers. They synergize very, very well with Chaos spells, however. This is because Chaos spells generally grant impressive offense bonuses for the price of defense/HP, making Stickthrowers (with their high HP) prime candidates for said buffs. In the event that that these buffs grant no penalty at all and give max bonuses to everything instead, for example, Stickthrowers could very well give even Elven and Dark Elven archers a run for their money.
